17" versus 18"

[bradc]

18's are legal, no problems there. Any rim diameter can be illegal. My 17x9.5" wheels would be illegal in Aus

 

[cyber_scriber]

Agreed Brad.

As per your recognition of wheel width, Tim's prior statement that "18's are 100% legal" is simply untrue.

There will be a great % of 18 inch rims that are not legal by virtue of their width.

The only 18 inch rims that are "legal" are where:

a) the rim width does not exceed the largest factory wheel width by more than 1 inch; and

b) the car's track is not increased by more than 1 inch.

I do realise that 18 x 7.5 may not be a terribly sexy width, but I'd rather not give the insurer a reason to refuse to pay out any claim.

 

[unclepaulie]

this has turned into an offset debate, looks vs legality,

i was trying to concentrate more on diameters and the pros and cons of each

im considering 17's as i plan to hav my car the same height as sleak's (he's a new member here) and that is well.... low, tyres tuckin guard....on the front muhahaha

i dont think the diameter of the wheel is a matter as far as legality, its the width of the rim





as far as width and offset goes, its minimum 8.5 with +35,

prefeably 9+35 or 8.5+33, yes 2mm makes all the difference

 

[steveP]

u guys are wrong about the insurance. u ARE allowed to have illegal mods. however ur car wont be covered if they are the cause of the accident.

lol and if some of u guys having a cry about track increasing 25mm. what about all the aftermarket ecu's u guys run. or aftermarket exhaust, which im sure exceeds the legal db level. or what about lowering the car past the minimum guard to hub height.

i just think its hypocritical some people having a go about width of a rim (which improves the car) when modifying other aspects of the car with no regard.



if u really care about keeping ur car 100% legal, dont buy a performance car.

 

[smohekey]

I have 17s on mine at the moment, with it lowered to about two fingers between the guard and tyre. It looks kinda stupid... the wheels don't really fill the guards out. I recommend 18s.

 

[dimi_108]

18"s won't compromise ride comfort at all.
17"s look good, but if you can get 18"s with decent offset, go for it.

I was originally looking for 17"s on mine but managed to come across 18"s.
Honestly, I would rather 17"s with nice offset, though.

Here are two examples of 17"s looking good on our cars.

Emanuel

Chris

 

[frozen]

ill second the point about offset.. i dont like the offset on my wheels much at all... i want them to be another 5-10mm out but i spose thats the compromise not buying brand new...

 

[unclepaulie]

Josh, i have seen your (not in person) but i reckon it looks the goods

if i can find some 17x9 +25's ill go them

 

[ygoslo]

OK well if we have to do all this rubbish again, I'm not going to back away. The discussion was about diameter. I said 18" wheels are just as legal as 17" wheels. That is, drumroll please, correct. Unsurprisingly, a 17x9 is just as illegal as an 18x9. Just as an 18x7 is just as legal as a 17x7.

I know I don't actually have to explain this, because if you stop and think for a second you know I'm right. But anyway...

And regarding insurance, I'd have thought an insurance company would be hard pressed to prove that an accident was caused by you having higher levels of grip than standard....

 

[ygoslo]

Josh, i have seen your (not in person) but i reckon it looks the goods

if i can find some 17x9 +25's ill go them

Buy my 17x9 +35 drift teks, then fit slip on spacers.

Oh hang on, they're too wide and spacers are illegal. Sorry for leading you down the road to delinquency.

 

[Gary31]

Wider tyres are more susceptible to aquaplaning.

 

[cyber_scriber]

I said 18" wheels are just as legal as 17" wheels.

This is not true Tim. This is your original statement:

18s are 100% legal unless you go putting some stupid 60 profile 300C tyres on them

In effect, you were suggesting that all (i.e. 100%) 18 inch wheels are legal, provided that the rolling diameter remains the same. Clearly, you now admit that your original statement is wrong because 18 inch wheels with certain widths are in fact, very illegal:

I'll stick with my illegal 9s ... and illegally increased track

Let us not forget that the reason why you made the original statement was to try and contradict my comment that 18 inch wheels are:

"Less likely to be legal (depending on rim width)." (emphasis added).

It looks like you forgot about the bit in brackets.

Remember, it's easy to get caught out when you make absolute statements like "100% legal". You're much better off with qualified statements like "less likely" and "depending on ..."

In your own words, I think you made the original statement "to annoy people" but unfortunately (for you), in this instance, you were wrong. No shame in that, mate.

regarding insurance, I'd have thought an insurance company would be hard pressed to prove that an accident was caused by you having higher levels of grip than standard....

Again Tim, this is not true. What you think and what your insurance Product Disclosure Statement ("PDS") says are very different things. Go and check out your PDS around your obligation to ensure that your car is roadworthy, complies with laws etc as a condition to being covered. More on this when I respond to Steve in a subsequent post.

Tim, the moral of the story is this - if you are going to go around "annoying people" (your words, not mine) by nit picking their posts, it's best that you ensure that your own house is in order too

 

[cyber_scriber]

Wider tyres are more susceptible to aquaplaning.

Correct Gary.

It is a misconception for people to assume that wider tyres = more grip in all circumstances.

 

[pu-11-me]

Tim and Bruce should go to lunch together..... And film it lol

 

[cyber_scriber]

u guys are wrong about the insurance. u ARE allowed to have illegal mods.

Steve, are you suggesting that an insurer (who operates within the confines of the law), would sanction illegal modifications?

I don't believe that any reputable insurer will authorise illegal mods. I am more than happy to be corrected if you can show me where in your insurance PDS it expressly permits you to have illegal mods. I have the Just Car PDS in front of me and cannot locate any such reference.

What I think you will find is that most insurance policies will contain provisions obliging you to keep your car in roadworthy condition, in good order, not engaged in illegal activities etc. This is a condition of your insurance policy. This means that if you fail to comply with that condition, the insurer may refuse your claim and / or cancel your policy. Case in point is the condition that you not drive under the influence of alcohol. If you cause an accident under the influence and arguably, it was because of something other than the alcohol, the insurer is still entitled to dismiss your claim if the policy condition is that you not drive under the influence.

Sure, specialist insurers will allow you to mod your car. Some allow X number of intake mods or Y number of engine mods. However, it is your ultimate responsibility to ensure that any mods comply with the Australian Design Rules and the relevant emissions, safety, RTA and other requirements. So unless you have it in writing from your insurer that yes, they agree to insure your car despite you having done illegal mod X or Y, I don't like your chances when it comes time to claim.

lol and if some of u guys having a cry about track increasing 25mm. what about all the aftermarket ecu's u guys run. or aftermarket exhaust, which im sure exceeds the legal db level. or what about lowering the car past the minimum guard to hub height.

i just think its hypocritical some people having a go about width of a rim (which improves the car) when modifying other aspects of the car with no regard.

There are at least 2 types of modifiers. The first modifies at will and with no regard for legality. They are generally younger drivers who must have the latest go fast bits, the fattest tyres, the loudest BOV etc and they don't care whether the mod is legal or not.

The other type of modifier enjoys the little enhancements to their car that usually doesn't have a materially adverse impact on the day to day driveability of the car. This kind of modifier also does not want to deal with the hassles of being defected or targeted by the police.

I tend to fall into the second category. The mods that I plan to my car are intended to be targetted, tasteful and legal. Where they are not legal at the first instance, I intend to have the mod engineered so that it is legal.

I don't find anything hypocritical about this. Instead of going for the loudest BOV I could find, I went for a recirculating Evo MR BOV. I have no intention of lowering the car to within an inch of its life as I expect the car to clear speed bumps and car parks without any precision driving required. So tell me, how is this hypocritical?

if u really care about keeping ur car 100% legal, dont buy a performance car.

I disagree with this. If the car you buy is close to your expectations of performance, handling etc, then there is very little need to go down the path of illegal mods. If it is not quite up to your expectations, I don't think it's difficult to mod and still keep the car 100% legal.

Also, I do believe there are many Ferraris, Lamborghini's, M3's, Porsches etc that are "100% legal" and yet, are still deemed to be a "performance car". Heck, even a 100% standard and legal Galant / Legnum would reasonably be regarded as a performance car!

 

[cyber_scriber]

Tim and Bruce should go to lunch together..... And film it lol

Happy to Dawso, provided that Tim is paying (and I don't put out on the first date ... lol!)

 

[steveP]

If i can assed, i'll scan in my insurance policy where it clearly lists all the modifications to my cars which are covered and part of the policy.

i disagree with ur '2 types of modifiers' theory. its never that clear cut. simply, people modify their cars, and some take more risks than others. i guess girly men will use legalalities as their scapegoat why they dont take the risks us others do.

yeah lambo's and all that are stock, but seriously, if u buy a lamo or ferrari, it doesnt need to be modified. comparing modified/tuner cars vs exotics, is like comparing apples with cement mixers.


end of the day. theres no noticeable different between 17 and 18 inch rims. 18's look better, and the only reason u would get 17's is coz u cant afford the the 18's.

 

[Guest]

Paul....

As you can see, everyone has their opinions and circumstances no doubt. Fortunately, it's your car and therefore your decision, so you need to decide what is right for you.

I'm running 17" wheels (Evo 7) at standard height as it suits my needs. Whilst there's enough room in the guards to fit several people's ego's in there, I have a family, so this car has to be practical. I never curse when seeing a speed hump or spoon drain and can always park in a sloped driveway.

I have chosen practicality in this instance. Funnily enough, I don't want this car to stand out, nor feel the need for attention.

 

[ygoslo]

Dear god. Bruce, no one likes a bush lawyer.

 

[ygoslo]

i guess girly men will use legalalities as their scapegoat why they dont take the risks us others do.

LOL!