Engine options.
- Thread starter trotty
- Start date
Everyone says that 6A's have limited aftermarket support
its lies
forged pistons are available off the shelf from wiseco, JE and getting custom ones made from the likes of CP are only marginally more expensive
Forged rods are available off the shelf from Pautermachine and Prism and custom ones available from many other places
ARP studs and other fasteners are just a length, size and thread pitch so easy to match others from other engines (as is currently happening via another thread.)
Valve springs are a direct fit from 4G63T's
larger valves are easy enough to adapt from other engines just read the catalouge and fine ones of similar length and stem size.
injectors are an easy fit. so are aftermarket coils (naughticas COP setup for example) and anyone firing for semi decent tune ability usually goes wire in aftermarket ecu (Link, Haltech, ViPEC, MoTec etc)
Intercooler kits, radiators and hard piping kits are also readily available.
as for turbos, most people who want something half pie decent doesn't buy off the shelf turbo kits, they choose a turbo suited to the application and then fork out to get a manifold and intake fabricated to suit.
Driveline stuff is direct swap from evo stuff such as LSD's PPG gear sets etc etc. I imagine similar length axles would be easily found from the likes of DSS (Drive Shaft Shop) also.
As much as everyone hates RPW they do sell cams, pistons and rods for the 6A13TT
and My work can easily do billet cams or regrinds.
so that basicly covers a build
If anything the lack of cheap crappy bolt on parts is what stops our cars ending up like a crappy civic with "da fully sick bolt on turbo kit and intercooler yo!" that everyone hates
below is the build thread of a 2JZ-GTE galant showing what needs to be done. although if you do pursue this I pray to god you will do a job 100 times better than that one.
http://www.thegalantcenter.org/showthread.php?47575-Toyota-2JZ-GTE-Engine-on-8G-Galant
so to conclude 6A13 is not as hard as everyone thinks, 2JZ has been done before 4g63 has been done before, so if you reallllly must do RWD I6 do the RB but do a 30DET with a 26 or NEO 25 head to be better than a 2J
/Rant
Badger
Leaving Skid Marks
Put a rotary in it hahaha
trotty
3 AYC Bars
- Location
- nsw
- First Name
- Daniel Trotman
- Drive
- 2000 vr4 Legnum 5 sp man
2006 Suzuki Swift Sport 5 sp man
- Thread starter
- #46
That 2jz is what gave me the idea that the rb would fit. I just like the wide variety that the Toyota and Nissan engines have and the proven numbers. The 6a not so many big builds that have proven reliability. I would love a drifter, BUT I can't go past the 4wd grip that the vr offers.
I'm sorry but putting a 2J or RB in just to be different is nuts. Especially if you want it legally registered.
Like people have said - a worked 6A in a Legnum putting out over 300kw IS different. And what sort of pride would you have when you do a 10sec 1/4 and when people ask what you have done/what motor u have put in etc and you tell them its " just a tubro upgrade on the standard motor
"
The swaps you are talking about are far from straight forward (except maybe the 4G's) and the money you spend doing it would build an awesome 6A and probably leave you enough for a around the world trip - you could personally pick up all the parts form the suppliers in Japan and USA
I am all for people doing things different and putting engines in places they aren't meant to go - but I think you still have to look at the type of car and original engine layout and work out what is a best fit and what will be worthwhile. Converting AWD to RWD AND going from lateral to longitudinal engine is a huge change and is just not worth it IMHO. Basically the car is already different - how many other twin turbo V6 AWD cars are there ?
I started out building a turbo rotary powered Subaru Brumby running WRX AWD gearbox and suspension. There is an adapter plate commercially available to bolt the motor and box together but after working on it I decided it would be far easier and cheaper to just stick with a WRX motor. Not only was I up for $1000 for the adapter plate but then I still needed to make engine mounts, cutom radiator, etc etc. the extra 50kw or so the rotary was going to provide was going to cost me an extra $3-5000 and on my budget ($50/wk) it just wasn't worth it. But if you had the money this would be a good conversion - the engine is almost exactly the same size externally as a WRX motor and both motors have a central crank (ie, roughly in the cnetre of the block vertically compare to say a straight 4/6 where the crank is at the bottom of the block) meaning the box/motor combo will sit in the right location.
Also financially the conversions that are worth anything tend to be older classics that NEED a modern motor/drivetrain - 240Z's with an RB30, Corona's with a 2JZ, Brumby's with a 13B turbo, early Mazdas with rotaries - well maybe not the Brumby Note how these are also the same platform swaps - inline motors and RWD, and from the same manufacturer - Nissan motor in a Nissan etc. Although there are a lot of cross bred conversions they are generally not worth the same or as sought after. A 2J or RB powered Legnum would be a hard sell at $3k I think, unless it is a proven 8sec 1/4 miler and then you would still struggle to sell for $10k - and it WILL cost you at least $30k. My Brumby owes me just under $10k at the moment and all I have done is collect parts - it is a completely bare shell and EVERYTHING is second hand. Although I now have just about everything I need I will still be up for at least another $5-10K and that is with me doing everything myself. WRX powered Brumbys are quite common and fetch probably $5-7.5K and even though mine is different and is running FULL WRX suspension and drivetrain (the body shell is the only Brumby part and that is not 100% Brumby since it has a WRX floor) making it a Brumby bodied WRX, rather than a WRX powered Brumby, it will be lucky to be worth $10k when its finished - and it will be an easy 10sec 1/4 mile car.
Modern cars with conversions tend to be worth LESS than the originals. Just look at Donkay's Legnum - $20k worth of parts in the brakes, auto, suspension etc and its worth the same as any other Legnum.
Good luck whichever way you go but I (and many others I think) would love to see the potential of the 6A.
Oh and one last thing - you won't have the worlds fastest Legnum if its straight 6 powered and RWD
Like people have said - a worked 6A in a Legnum putting out over 300kw IS different. And what sort of pride would you have when you do a 10sec 1/4 and when people ask what you have done/what motor u have put in etc and you tell them its " just a tubro upgrade on the standard motor
"The swaps you are talking about are far from straight forward (except maybe the 4G's) and the money you spend doing it would build an awesome 6A and probably leave you enough for a around the world trip - you could personally pick up all the parts form the suppliers in Japan and USA
I am all for people doing things different and putting engines in places they aren't meant to go - but I think you still have to look at the type of car and original engine layout and work out what is a best fit and what will be worthwhile. Converting AWD to RWD AND going from lateral to longitudinal engine is a huge change and is just not worth it IMHO. Basically the car is already different - how many other twin turbo V6 AWD cars are there ?
I started out building a turbo rotary powered Subaru Brumby running WRX AWD gearbox and suspension. There is an adapter plate commercially available to bolt the motor and box together but after working on it I decided it would be far easier and cheaper to just stick with a WRX motor. Not only was I up for $1000 for the adapter plate but then I still needed to make engine mounts, cutom radiator, etc etc. the extra 50kw or so the rotary was going to provide was going to cost me an extra $3-5000 and on my budget ($50/wk) it just wasn't worth it. But if you had the money this would be a good conversion - the engine is almost exactly the same size externally as a WRX motor and both motors have a central crank (ie, roughly in the cnetre of the block vertically compare to say a straight 4/6 where the crank is at the bottom of the block) meaning the box/motor combo will sit in the right location.
Also financially the conversions that are worth anything tend to be older classics that NEED a modern motor/drivetrain - 240Z's with an RB30, Corona's with a 2JZ, Brumby's with a 13B turbo, early Mazdas with rotaries - well maybe not the Brumby
Note how these are also the same platform swaps - inline motors and RWD, and from the same manufacturer - Nissan motor in a Nissan etc. Although there are a lot of cross bred conversions they are generally not worth the same or as sought after. A 2J or RB powered Legnum would be a hard sell at $3k I think, unless it is a proven 8sec 1/4 miler and then you would still struggle to sell for $10k - and it WILL cost you at least $30k. My Brumby owes me just under $10k at the moment and all I have done is collect parts - it is a completely bare shell and EVERYTHING is second hand. Although I now have just about everything I need I will still be up for at least another $5-10K and that is with me doing everything myself. WRX powered Brumbys are quite common and fetch probably $5-7.5K and even though mine is different and is running FULL WRX suspension and drivetrain (the body shell is the only Brumby part and that is not 100% Brumby since it has a WRX floor) making it a Brumby bodied WRX, rather than a WRX powered Brumby, it will be lucky to be worth $10k when its finished - and it will be an easy 10sec 1/4 mile car.Modern cars with conversions tend to be worth LESS than the originals. Just look at Donkay's Legnum - $20k worth of parts in the brakes, auto, suspension etc and its worth the same as any other Legnum.
Good luck whichever way you go but I (and many others I think) would love to see the potential of the 6A.
Oh and one last thing - you won't have the worlds fastest Legnum if its straight 6 powered and RWD
R Kilburn
Leaving Skid Marks
6a13 forged Mivec sounds good
I've only seen a 2.6L upgrade via extended rings.
4g64
2.6L stroker
gt35 or bigger
evo box/transfer
non ayc rear end
spend the fab time making a front subframe/strut towers to run evo9 LCA's, hubs and front uprights
2.6L stroker
gt35 or bigger
evo box/transfer
non ayc rear end
spend the fab time making a front subframe/strut towers to run evo9 LCA's, hubs and front uprights
G
Guest
Unregistered
I know most people don't like the idea of "Evo-Ising" a VR4, but if you are gonna swap, stay mistsi AND have a sweet engine.
Even 4g64, Aggressive Cams, Biggish turbo while retaining AWD, you will easily see 400awkw, with minimal lag and intense torque.
Ultra reliable, easy to source, many familiar builders, fairly straightforward swap (for how hard some swaps CAN be)
Even 4g64, Aggressive Cams, Biggish turbo while retaining AWD, you will easily see 400awkw, with minimal lag and intense torque.
Ultra reliable, easy to source, many familiar builders, fairly straightforward swap (for how hard some swaps CAN be)
I think we are all just starting to throw random ideas out that make no sense. Seriously why would you do an engine conversion and go through all the bullshit involved? There is nothing wrong with building the 6a13tt and as mentioned there are parts available for this engine like cams, pistons, rods and valves.
I think some of us are getting a bit side tracked here, at the moment I am in the middle of a 6a13tt build. I have PRISM rods, WISECO pistons and rings, custom made exhaust valves from the states, cam regrinds and springs from NZ and ARP rod bolts and oversized head studs. I have had no problems acquiring these parts.
Also what you need is someone with a full machine shop that knows how to build a motor. Im not gona go into what machining im doing but I am going full race port on the heads. This along with big huffers I already have and E85 we are aiming for well over 300kw.
I think some of us are getting a bit side tracked here, at the moment I am in the middle of a 6a13tt build. I have PRISM rods, WISECO pistons and rings, custom made exhaust valves from the states, cam regrinds and springs from NZ and ARP rod bolts and oversized head studs. I have had no problems acquiring these parts.
Also what you need is someone with a full machine shop that knows how to build a motor. Im not gona go into what machining im doing but I am going full race port on the heads. This along with big huffers I already have and E85 we are aiming for well over 300kw.
Garrett GT2554 housing with GT2860rs comp wheels and custom made anti surge comp covers.
Thats why people need to do the 6A13 more.
Don't take this the wrong way, a rb swapped galant/legnum would be cool.
But having one of the few highly modded 6A's in the world would be just as awesome, plus the whole original engine factor, if you catch my drift
but so many people talk about what you are mentioning, "awww my v6 is too hard to mod give me a easy motor with off the shelf parts" then they spend thousands of $$ and hours upon hours fitting the new motor to the chassis only to end up needing to get custom parts anyway to achieve high end power goals.
Im definatly not saying a 6a13 is better than a RB/JZ/4G, as I can't because people havent pushed 6A's to failure enough to judge their common weak points
The 4G is by far the easiest option and proven to huge power levels but its been done and done and done in the US where they never got the 6a, so why not do the 6a some justice and show these 4 cylinder boys that a V6 can keep up and do it in style too.
why would you spend all that time and effort to go to mc-phearson strut when it is inferior to our stock multilink setup? just spend the same time/money making our multilink setup adjustable and laugh all the way home.
+1 to you sir. I do eagerly await some dyno plots from your finished build
A guy here in christchurch with what was to my knowledge was an uncracked standard engine (stock cams, valves, springs, pistons and rods) just had a big single turbo conversion, link ecu bigger injectors and custom intake plenum made 290kW at the wheels so with your e85, ported heads, cams, forged internals and all the other jazz will see you well over 300 IMHO
hell I made 214 Kw atw on my car which I tuned my self on stock turbos and was the first car I had ever tuned!
