This is what happens if you don't replace your control arms (or go aftermarket)

[BuzzPuppy]

Contacted my dad who works @ Chadstone Mitsubishi (Melbourne, VIC) for the parts and a quote. Dropped him the link to this thread as well. We'll see how we go.

Kudos to Kenneth for the part numbers too!

 

[[TUFFTR]]

I say this is an inherent fault considering out of the two 20 year old mitsubishi's I own (with heavily lowered suspension if it makes any difference) I've never once seen a lower ball joint fail. Mind you, one of my Mitsubishi's is a JDM import from 1991 with almost 300K on the clock, and from what I can tell, OEM ball joints.

or were tardy in replacing a critical component once they knew it needed replacing is very short sighted.

Not to mention, not many people would know about this flaw upon joining this forum, or buying a legnum/galant in general, how do they as owners know about these flaws which should be checked and rectified ASAP. I can tell you now, tiv puts maintenance of his two cars ahead of ANY modification first and foremost, so kenneth, granted tiv or I had known about this, this would of been on his priority list straight up. However how are we supposed to know if this thread just falls to the bottom?

This should be made a sticky to warn people of this 'flaw'. And it is a flaw until fixed with the proper updated component. Until then, hell, you could be driving a deathtrap. It just needs to be known so this doesn't happen to anyone.

I appreciate what you wrote kenneth. Especially to do with the Chinese lower joints. I purchased some sway bar links for the rear of my Diamante from this seller. They look fine, but as far as quality goes, who knows what the hell metal they use in china? Looks and longevity are worlds apart. I am with you on this though, I would steer clear of a Chinese component for this application, sway bar links and the like...I don't mind using Chinese ones as if they fail your car isn't going to implode.

 

[Macca]

The spate of failures highlighted the inherent problems with not checking ball joints regularly and brought about a knowledge of how to ascertain when they were near failure.

So whats the best way to check if they are close to failure?

 

[Kenneth]

Not as such, I just email Bill who you can contact through their website contact email address. Bill seems to be a good bloke and the prices are as good as I have gotten from Mitsubishi when they try to persuade you they are selling it to you below cost

So you said you do have a connection at ralliart who can order these directly?

 

[Guest]

perhaps, geniune LCA's are the best and only option.

I thought this was decided a while back, so I was surprised that people were interested in saving a few bucks over their safety and still buying eBay ones instead. But I'd be interested to see an actual side by side comparison of the original failing arms and the redesigned ones. Then also see which ones the eBay arms have been copied from.

So whats the best way to check if they are close to failure?

I remember seeing a post a long time ago either here on or CVR4 that showed how to check for play using a long bar for leverage.

 

[Kenneth]

As I said in the post, I didn't direct my comment about maintenance at tiv. I wasn't there and don't know any of the history of his car. However the fact remains that in general, most failures happen when there are clear indications that the ball joints need to be checked.

I would agree that the ball joint orientation was a poor design choice. A fault, I cannot agree with. If serviced properly and replaced when needed, they will not fail.

You are correct that there is a problem with knowing about this issue. However, if someone buys car, never does an oil change and then one day the engine siezes, who's fault is it that they did not know that engines need oil?
You cannot blame Mitsubishi that they designed a part which requires maintenance and it failed because you did not know that maintenance was needed. When you choose to take on the role of servicing a vehicle yourself, you need to know what parts require checking at what intervals. If you don't, you need to be willing to accept that some parts will fail along the way and that you will learn from those.

It is a shame these failures happen and I have sympathy for those it happens to. I don't think it is fair to point the finger at Mitsubishi though.

I say this is an inherent fault considering out of the two 20 year old mitsubishi's I own (with heavily lowered suspension if it makes any difference) I've never once seen a lower ball joint fail. Mind you, one of my Mitsubishi's is a JDM import from 1991 with almost 300K on the clock, and from what I can tell, OEM ball joints.



Not to mention, not many people would know about this flaw upon joining this forum, or buying a legnum/galant in general, how do they as owners know about these flaws which should be checked and rectified ASAP. I can tell you now, tiv puts maintenance of his two cars ahead of ANY modification first and foremost, so kenneth, granted tiv or I had known about this, this would of been on his priority list straight up. However how are we supposed to know if this thread just falls to the bottom?

This should be made a sticky to warn people of this 'flaw'. And it is a flaw until fixed with the proper updated component. Until then, hell, you could be driving a deathtrap. It just needs to be known so this doesn't happen to anyone.

I appreciate what you wrote kenneth. Especially to do with the Chinese lower joints. I purchased some sway bar links for the rear of my Diamante from this seller. They look fine, but as far as quality goes, who knows what the hell metal they use in china? Looks and longevity are worlds apart. I am with you on this though, I would steer clear of a Chinese component for this application, sway bar links and the like...I don't mind using Chinese ones as if they fail your car isn't going to implode.

 

[Kenneth]

There are usually signs when they are close. Creaking, squeeking and knocking sounds are most common.

In general servicing, you first need to check that it isn't seized. This should be fairly obvious as usually it requires no lubrication and there is a lot of rust.

Eventually wear will mean that play develops which you can check for. This usually shows before there are audible clues though, so by the time you hear something amiss, they NEED to be changed. I have heard of them creaking for months before failure and as little as a couple of days. You just can't tell so it isn't worth risking it.

To check them you need to do the following

Jack the car up and put on stands (front 2 wheels off the ground)
You need to be able to get under the car

With a pry bar you can try and separate the lower arm and the hub carrier. If there is any independent movement, the ball joint needs replacing. Often it is better to have your free hand on the ball joint itself as you can feel it click much easier.
Without a prybar you need to get something onto the hub carrier so that you car lift it (you might be able to just do this to the wheel) so that it tries to lift the hub carrier off the ball joint.

So whats the best way to check if they are close to failure?

 

[Macca]

Cheers for that mate. I think I'll give mine a check next time I have the car up.

 

[ygoslo]

Awaiting prices on genuine ones. I have a front end knock at low speeds, but without knowing it is the LCAs I don't want to change them out at this point. Especially for aftermarket ones, seeing as they appear destined to fail.

 

[unclepaulie]

Just a note:

With christians, his passenger side failed and had zero lubricant in it,

Yet his drivers side was like new and still packed with grease, so check both.


Also, kenneth, regarding the non genuine arms, what was the average fail time of them on cvr4 and was it due to poor maintenance/ no lubrication?

 

[steveP]

Well I got a feeling I need mine replaced urgently. If I need to get OEM parts in a few years down the track, so be it, I'll eat the cost. Would much rather spend an extra few hundred dollars than it breaking and dealing with the aftermath. Anyway they will arrive next week.

With mine, they are knocking when I drive over un even surfaces like bricks. I would say to replace them regardless as a safety precaution if you get any type of front end knocking.

Regarding not pointing the finger at mitsubishi, I believe they are partly responsible. Oil/etc are obvious parts to a car which needs maintenance. I've never heard of other cars ball joins collapsing. Clearly this is a fault with our cars if it's not happening to other mitsubishi's. It should be clearly stated somewhere within the car or manual.


Also pauly, with yours, did you have to lubricate them, or they came all ready to go? With the ebay ones, I would use the same techniques to determine when they need replacing; rattling, squeeking, etc.

 

[Guest]

FWIW.. I believe Ford Territories also suffered from the same problem as they used a similar set up. Does anyone know much about what happened with them? Was it the exact same cause of failure, and what was the solution.. and was it redesigned in later models?

http://www.neebs.com.au/default.asp?cmd=product&productid=45538

Looks like the Falcons had a slightly different set up, but weren't immune from failure either.

http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11285170

 

[Interloper]

best looking falcon i've seen in years :O

 

[unclepaulie]

Well I got a feeling I need mine replaced urgently. If I need to get OEM parts in a few years down the track, so be it, I'll eat the cost. Would much rather spend an extra few hundred dollars than it breaking and dealing with the aftermath. Anyway they will arrive next week.

With mine, they are knocking when I drive over un even surfaces like bricks. I would say to replace them regardless as a safety precaution if you get any type of front end knocking.

Regarding not pointing the finger at mitsubishi, I believe they are partly responsible. Oil/etc are obvious parts to a car which needs maintenance. I've never heard of other cars ball joins collapsing. Clearly this is a fault with our cars if it's not happening to other mitsubishi's. It should be clearly stated somewhere within the car or manual.


Also pauly, with yours, did you have to lubricate them, or they came all ready to go? With the ebay ones, I would use the same techniques to determine when they need replacing; rattling, squeeking, etc.

They were all good to go. I'll definitely be keeping an eye/ear on them and will pull them part every so often to check, As im Not sure on the quality of the boots etc and the preventative maintenance won't be a bad thing.

 

[smitty]

Jesus, the xr8 runabout at work is making some serious noises from the front end...

 

[[TUFFTR]]

Funny you mention that Kenneth.....tiv's car was making a creaking noise for a few months prior....local suspension place said it was probably a lower control arm bush! Guess tiv or I will probably head down and let them know if they have another leggy or galant in with similar issues for them to look and test the ball joints!

Only thing I have to say Kenneth, and hey, I've learnt something new, I'm only young myself, naive at times but hopefully I'm changing that....from the work I've done on cars over the years....I did know ball joints needed to be replaced...had to do 4 of them on an XD falcon...great fun.....but on a 10 year old car it never even crossed out minds to delve deeper into testing these, especially when both dust boots looked perfect, and neither of us knew about this existing problem.

I understand totally where you come from.

It would be great if a mod (yet again I know I'm pushing the point here) made this a sticky to do a few things
-Alert fellow OzVr4'ers to this problem
-how them how to test the ball joints
-hopefully never have someone like myself and tiv post about what it's done to the car because we never knew it needed maintenance

It's something you overlook, but on a 10 year old car you really just think there are bigger things to worry about.
Bit of a catch 22 really. I really hope everyone puts off that FMIC kit or exhaust and does these first

Slower car > broken car

 

[Black_Ice]

Awaiting prices on genuine ones. I have a front end knock at low speeds, but without knowing it is the LCAs I don't want to change them out at this point. Especially for aftermarket ones, seeing as they appear destined to fail.

Hey Tim, i'm keen on getting original control arms as well as i too have a knock oor clunk coming from the front end and ony happens at low speeds..could u pls PM the prices when you get them from Bill....Cheers

 

[naughtika]

if you hear 'creaking' sound.. that means you have metal to metal scrubbing.. where as 'squeaking' is due to the bushes scrubbing against metal..

both can be temporarily be solve by using some sort of lubricant, usually a grease.. where as with the ball joint, its a little bit harder as you need to really diagnose each and 1 ball joint to pin point if which one is really causing the issue..

 

[Black_Ice]

Well its more of a 'clunking' sounds and it happens at random but usually at low speeds..there are some days when i'll hear it 10 times and other when I will hear it once...Been to pedders they cant hear the sound an said everything looks alright..doubt they did anything more than have a glance...no body seems to be able to tell me whats causing this sounds..others here who have had that problem resort to changing their control arms but if the control arms are not the problem I dont want to change them with OEM parts...

Can someone pls put up a picture of the lower control arm with the ball joint...Cheers!

 

[mchieff]

Lower control arm is circled
Arrow points to the ball joint on the lower control arm

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