Shifting and rev alteration issues

[vr4cobra]

as a fair few of you guys know i recently got my car back after getting the autobox rebuilt, i had a few minor issues i found straight away and fixed myself ( BOV not activating-no vacume ended up being water in the line, both front brake disc gaurds were rubbing on the inside of the discs- pulled them off the discs)... Looks like they left my car outside in the rain probly even with the hood up at some stage...

My old box was completely smashed basicly all the gears ect non repairable so i bought a box from lathiat and they replaced all plates, soft parts, upgrade wave spring, as well as swapped the only gear that wasnt damaged in my box into that one since it was the only one damaged in the new box. so i would think it would run as smooth as stans ovr444...

Ive taken it fairly easy so far no more then quater throttle and rarely gettin past 4000rpm (mainly shifting 3000rpm) as i dont wanna damage it before the new plates bed in properly..

So ive done approx 400km's since getting it back and its having shifting issues again basicly the same as before i broke my old box, so when its cold it stutters between first and second under mild acceleration, same as most other gears ( I noticed 5th seems to do it alot under mild acceleration i noticed thanks to a long trip up the coast this arvo)...
Also when holding accelerator in same possision accelerating up the hill the revs seem to drop up to 1000rpm and slowly build up again almost seems like it goes up another gear especially in 4th and 5th gears but sometimes in lower gears. then after cruising same speed start to accelerate slightly the revs pick up 500-1000rpm (like kicking back a gear) then level back down again even with increasing the throttle slightly more...

So they are my issues and i was wondering if it could be a sensor or computer issue or something, just thought id ask the experts before i return to the place that rebuilt the box and abuse them for stuffin it up

 

[vr4cobra]

under low revs and soft acceleration it shifts relitivly quickly and smoothly but under mild acceleration it stutters or takes a sec or 2 to change up a gear and when downshifting it also depends on revs but it still takes a lil to down shift

 

[vr4cobra]

to further ad more ive done the 400km's on this tank and im almost on E not quite low enough for the light to come on yet but 300km's of that is highway driving and the other 100 is soft to mild accelerating i think my sparkies are dure for replacement but i doubt its the reason for all these issues (maybe economy)

 

[Guest]

Flaring when cold is normal, it takes 30 mins to heat up to operating temp. If the battery has been disconnected if may take a tank or so for the TCU to relearn the shift points. I find it's best to drive really conservatively for a while or it gets a bit confused. If in doubt, disconnect your battery for a few mins and start fresh.

Apart from that.. what ATF did they use? Do they specialist in Mitsubishi or Hyundai transmissions? Anything said about the state of your torque converter? Was any other rebuild kit used (ie: did they use new clutch plates)? Did they comment on the accumulator spring seats or replace the seals for them? Did they do a pressure test and what were the results?

 

[hozza]

Your computer learns on how you drive and it changes gears accordingly, give it a couple more days to wear in then start driving it how you use to.
It should stat to come good.

 

[vr4cobra]

I hope so just seems a bit od thats all.. All clutch plates seals ect were replaced the torque converter was rebuilt ect it was a full overhaul so I hope its just settling it like I said ive been driving conservatively so far so I dont damage anything... Guess I better rack up some kms see how it goes... May call up get pressure test readings ect too and exact type oil they used

 

[Guest]

Ok, so what did they replace the clutch plates with? The old ones from the other box or brand new ones from a kit? I'm asking because with one of the main kits for our transmission I was helping someone install, we found some of the parts either just did not fit at all or appeared substandard compared to factory.

There is another catch too. A tiny oil seal that if you aren't familiar with these transmissions you will damage on reassembly and cause an internal pressure leak. No easy way to test for that sorry.

Find out how much ATF they used too, the dipstick is incredibly difficult to read correctly. They should have put 8.9 litres in.

You may want to check your transfer case fluid is correct spec & level ASAP too. They would have had to refill this in the process.

A boost leak test would be a smart move too, as various pipes have been removed & refitted to get to the trans.

Finally.. which transmission housing did they end up using for the rebuild, yours or Lathiat's? If Lathiat's then you may also need a new TCU as it could be a different variant. Try to get the numbers off the top of the box (there is a thread around here that tells you where to look) and post them up together with your car's date of manufacture.

 

[vr4cobra]

Lathiats box had same numbers as mine and I belive his leg was 96 same as my galant. Ill have to find all that out tomorrow but the brand new clutches and ive noticed a small leak on 2 hoses I think to the cooler but havnt had a great look. I pretty much had all the intercooler pipes on that side of the engine bay off already trying to sorce the bov issue and I made surethey were tightened properly but whos to say there isnt more missing, I also fixed a hole in one the vacume lines at the same time and she seems to be spoiling up nicely to 12-13psi but never know if there is more leaks I guess

 

[vr4cobra]

well shifts seem to be getting better, smoother and faster after doing another 150km's...
I was just wondering if other guys autos have a decent delay length between shifts in tiptronic mode? as this is my first auto i was wondering cause my shifts feel like an eternity between gears other autos ive driven with tiptronic seem to shift almost instantainious so i figured it should shift fairly quickly not a second later.
If this isnt normal wat could be causing it?
and i still have the rev changing odly like i said at the start of the post

Also when holding accelerator in same possision accelerating up the hill the revs seem to drop up to 1000rpm and slowly build up again almost seems like it goes up another gear especially in 4th and 5th gears but sometimes in lower gears. then after cruising same speed start to accelerate slightly the revs pick up 500-1000rpm (like kicking back a gear) then level back down again even with increasing the throttle slightly more...

 

[Guest]

No, mine's very quick I couldn't wish for better. However a mate's is a bit laboured even after we did a full rebuild. It's not bad, but we would have expected it to be like mine after all the work we did.

So we are pondering what to do about that at the moment actually. I'm thinking of trying to get an oil pressure gauge onto the various external tap in points for a start. If that's ok then start looking at the valve body. I'd expect solenoids to be pretty much instant, but there could be something binding there. If the pressure is too low then it's possible adjust the pressure up as a whole, or shim the accumulator pistons/springs and/or expand some valve body galleries. Yay!

Pretty much it all comes down to the hydraulic system. The TCU can tell the transmission's solenoids when to switch gears by directing the ATF flow to various areas, but it doesn't have any control over what happens during the shift.

A dud wave spring can also cause bodgy shifts, but you say that's all been taken care of.

 

[vr4cobra]

well my old box was slow shifting too but it did need a rebuild so i put it down to that but even this rebuilt box is doing it hmm may have to find out wat from my old box was kept exactly and go from there... oh the joy

 

[vr4cobra]

ok so here is the list of repairs done

Ok so here is wat the car is doing at this stage now.
1. The revs are still altering unusually
2. The gears are shifting alot smoother and faster but are a lil harsh clicking in
3. 5th gear still slipping before engaging properly
4. In tiptronic mode it takes almost a second before it shifts into gear (used to happen before gearbox was rebuilt so i suspected that was the issue) and first page of invoice stated the solinoids where tested and operating fine.
5. The old battery did die so it was left disconnected for atleast a few weeks before i replaced the battery (done approx 1000km's since)
6. Fuel ecconomy is out the window driving softly... did just over 400km's for 52L first tank 300km's hiway, just over 300km's to 52L, last 100km's I drove normally so a bit heavy footed (was at 160km's at half tank), and in progress of the next tank
7. On idle it sometimes has a bit of white smoke out of the exhaust and smells fuelly, doesnt matter it it was cold or hot and doesnt matter how i drive it softer or harder.
8. When de-cellerating there is a small backfire (havnt checked plugs or leads yet) I kinda like it
9. The power output seems to alternate a little bit, for instance last night she ran beautifully plenty of power from the word go, this morning didnt go to bad was fairly responsive with felt a lil underpower, approx lunch time drove fine more responsive with more power then morning, then just after that it wasnt as responsive and felt under powered but just this arvo it was more responsive again and had the power back... obviously it was cooler lastnight so drove better but its been fairly cool all day and barely any temp changes. im suspecting a bit of a boost leak somewhere.

I kinda guess the rev alterations may be a sensor or combination of sensors as it kicks the revs back up after pushing the A peddle harder but once i back it off a bit it drops right back down again...

anyone have any ideas on wat i can do to test issues? or if someone in brisbane wound have a few hours free when i get back from work to have a look and give me thier profecinal opinion?
I will be doing plugs and leads when i get back in a fortnight just to be certin but I think the issues are a lil beyond that

 

[Guest]

Transmission Fluid MS5, I wonder what that is? Call them first thing tomorrow and ask for the more info about brand and specification/rating of what they used.

But I'd Replace it with genuine Mitsubishi SPIII ATF and do a full loooong flush to get it all out. You will require 15 to 20 litres for a flush to be sure all that old ATF is out. The usual amount is 12L for a flush but I'd go for even more than usual.

So, 3 to 4 of the 5L containers of SPIII, they cost about $45 from a Mitsubishi dealer spare parts department.

Now would also be a good time to pull your diagnostic codes and report back again.

http://ozvr4.com/forums/showthread.php?2415-Diagnostic-Codes-The-Full-List

Edit: I'm still curious as to what they filled your transfer case with, as it's not specified in detail. I would replace that too using Castrol Syntrax, or next thing you might find your transfer case will get whiny and die.

 

[TME_Steve]

Hey mate, Got your pm, I'd be looking at this for your economy woes, but also what is the white smoke you mention. Is the oil in the engine nice and clear or a bit milky?

 

[vr4cobra]

thanks guys im affraid ill have to wait 2 weeks before i can do anything on my car oh the joys of working away but ill deff give them a call and get exact specs on what they have put in who knows they might have to replace the oil if they didnt follow manufacturers spec. as for engine oil still golden with tinge black but seems a lil higher then last time i checked 2000km's ago but could just be more settled now then last time i checked, and i only seviced it approx 3000km's ago with nullons 5W-40 I think it was and drift oil filter. so it doesnt seem to be using oil if anything it could be making a lil, possable fuel bypassing ring from over fueling??? just a thought

 

[vr4cobra]

also when i get back from work ill be doing the front mount kit custom with my mate so ill be going all over for any damaged vacume lines and replace all soft pipes with steel ones so hopefully that will solve any leaks aswell as installing a transmission cooler at the same time and custom front pipes 2 1/2" (do the rest of exhaust at a later date 3" Cat and back to either 5" cannon or duel 4" pipes (one each side) out the ass with 3" varex muffler incase it gets too droany )

 

[vr4cobra]

Ok called the trans job this morning. They used Marklubricants fully synth 75 auto trans oil equiv to dex5 and full synth gear oil in transfer case (couldnt tell me exact specs on oil as half the labels were missing on their drum), they use in all there trans ect and have never had an issue inc mercs ect
He also said the late shifting sounds like a speed sensor fault and will repair under warranty when I get back from work.
They also modified the shift kit for faster shifting aswell.
Next is the rev alterations he said my car has a duel stage torque converter which is why it does those alterations.

 

[Guest]

There's your problem ^^ morons.

Change those fluids for the correct spec before you even drive it again!

Not sure if I'd trust them to do it either, perhaps find a knowledgeable member up your way to help you DIY it?

Start there before taking it back for "repairs" and making things worse.

Read up about all the problems on here you get when Dextron ATF is used instead of SPIII too

Pulling your diagnostic codes will tell you if any sensors are faulty too. It's a basic task to do that yourself, just need a paperclip!

full synth gear oil in transfer case (couldnt tell me exact specs on oil as half the labels were missing on their drum)

Gotta be concerned when they don't know what actual oil they are using.. Weight? GL rating? arghhhh

 

[vr4cobra]

yeah im a lil worried bout it too but i think i will take it to them to change to sender no cash outta my poket plus while im there ill scope out the lube they used and put up the details before i go spending money replacing it all who knows the grading might actually be alright but ill never get all the info i need unless i look in person.
im not that goot at diy diagnostics checking so i might get someone to give me a hand thats done it before just to make sure its all good i no ill miss something that way if the oil does need to be replaced then i could get first hand pointers of how to do it myself next time

 

[Guest]

I predict this isn't going to end well